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mtjerneld · 2013-03-24, 09:51

Samsung just announced an addon to their 7500 and 8000 series HDTVs that looks possibly interesting for XBMC if it's built on any half open platform and would allow for custom software. Getting XBMC to run with good performance natively on my TV without the need for external hardware would be the new black!

Quote: Set to be available in May for $299 (and packaged with Samsung's Smart Remote) the evolution kit will include a new quad-core processor, GPU and extra memory that all add up to faster performance and multi-tasking between Smart TV apps.

http://www.theverge.com/2013/3/20/412755...ps-may-399

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~~Ned Scott~~ · 2013-03-24, 09:54

$300 for what's probably just ARM hardware that docks with only one brand of TV? meh....

mtjerneld · 2013-03-24, 10:02

Yup, very proprietary, but at least these models are (probably) market leaders.

I'm not saying that this is a catch all, but getting XBMC running native on modern TVs would be an interesting prospect, and Samsung's SmartHub is one of the larger platforms. This hw-box only serves to bring older models up to speed, the 9-series will most likely have the equiv performance already built in.

I'm sure that XBMC on Smarthub has been discussed before, but it probably would not have made much sense before the TVs actually starts packing some decent hardware. That time seems to be now...

~~Ned Scott~~ · 2013-03-24, 10:20

Yeah, but you can do the same thing with a $100 box, which is most likely just as powerful, and connect it to the HDMI port of any TV. I bet the SmartHub dock is nothing more than HDMI + power + some kind of two way communication for various functions.

The existence of hardware doesn't mean much at all. A lot of great hardware exists that could run XBMC, but there's pretty much no incentive to undertake the massive porting of XBMC and all the things it depends on to a new device/OS when it's something as limited as this. There's probably all sorts of developer restrictions on the apps that can be made, and various non-disclosure agreements that have to be signed, all of which don't jive well with an Open Source project like XBMC.

mtjerneld · 2013-03-24, 10:49

As a long time user of XBMC (dates back to the XBMP days) I've always longed for the day where I wont need any extra hardware apart from my TV to run XBMC. Like you say, the hardware to do so is already there, but layers of closed (vendor specific) software and regulatory stuff is still in the way.

I do believe that it's just a matter of time before Samsung, LG and the others start to realize that maintaining their own SmartTV OS is not worth the hazzle, and that the cheap Android devices that start to pop up everywhere will soon be far superior in function, making a proprietary platform less of a competitive advantage.

I'll just sit tight and wait for the first TV-vendor to release a TV with an unlocked vanilla Android OS or a possibility to install Linux (or if Apple actually makes an iOS TV and someone manages to unlock it), and we'll talk again! Might be soon, might be never... Big Grin

nitesh · 2013-03-28, 13:21

Interestingly I think the opposite, I think tv's need to stop on all the extra rubbish and stick with creating high quality video and sound.
Might even bring down the price of some tvs....
Now we have things like openelec which gives the feel of an "appliance" that just works on lots of different hardware.
This gives us lots of options but also keeps prices down...

**Chris!** · 2013-03-28, 16:39

(2013-03-28, 13:21)nitesh Wrote: Interestingly I think the opposite, I think tv's need to stop on all the extra rubbish and stick with creating high quality video and sound.
Might even bring down the price of some tvs....
Now we have things like openelec which gives the feel of an "appliance" that just works on lots of different hardware.
This gives us lots of options but also keeps prices down...

Indeed. Give me the best quality panel and sound then I can choose from a wealth of great ARM devices to get my content and GUI (as NedScott says)

Of course it's in the TV manufacturers best interest to get you using their TV extra so they can sell you content and perhaps even lock you into their ecosystem al la Apple or Android app stores.

**Martijn** · 2013-03-28, 16:41

(2013-03-28, 16:39)Chris! Wrote:
(2013-03-28, 13:21)nitesh Wrote: Interestingly I think the opposite, I think tv's need to stop on all the extra rubbish and stick with creating high quality video and sound.
Might even bring down the price of some tvs....
Now we have things like openelec which gives the feel of an "appliance" that just works on lots of different hardware.
This gives us lots of options but also keeps prices down...

Indeed. Give me the best quality panel and sound then I can choose from a wealth of great ARM devices to get my content and GUI (as NedScott says)

Of course it's in the TV manufacturers best interest to get you using their TV extra so they can sell you content and perhaps even lock you into their ecosystem al la Apple or Android app stores.

I couldn't agree more. Drop all the useless junk on the tv and just let it be a quality display. Leave the "smart" things to small dedicated boxes.

mtjerneld · (This post was last modified: 2013-03-28, 22:00 by mtjerneld.)

I totally see your point. But I think it's in part due to the fact that anything "Smart" we've seen so far has really been really dumb. TV vendors should never get into the media center business, and that is not what I'm trying to say. Actually, they should stay as far away from it as possible. Just to think that they could develop something even close to XBMC is ridiculous (12 years development with an involved community vs. a small inhouse devteam on a tight schedule).

What I am saying is that I hate cables, extra remotes and clutter underneath my TV. And since the computing power needed to run XBMC recently became dirt cheap, I don't see a reason why my TV shouldn't be able to house it. And I definitely don't understand why anybody would consider it a negative if it did.

Hopefully I can bring this thread to live a year or two from now with a big "this is what I'm talking about" Big Grin

artrafael · 2013-03-28, 23:20

(2013-03-28, 21:58)mtjerneld Wrote: And since the computing power needed to run XBMC recently became dirt cheap, I don't see a reason why my TV shouldn't be able to house it. And I definitely don't understand why anybody would consider it a negative if it did.

I don't want to pay for extraneous hardware built into the TV now and, even if I did, I don't want to have to buy a completely new TV a couple of years down the line just to get a more powerful on-board computer to support some future format that may require extra compute power.

mtjerneld · 2013-03-29, 00:50

(2013-03-28, 23:20)artrafael Wrote: I don't want to pay for extraneous hardware built into the TV now...

Well, the hardware is gonna be in there anyway. Just that it won't let you use it for anything but proprietary stuff. Kind of my point...

Taking a lot of flak on this one, but I like the comments. Let me turn the question around. If you could get a TV-set with an on-board computer powerful enough to run XBMC and any current codec that progressivley pushes all the pixels on the panel. Would you still opt for an external hardware?

artrafael · (This post was last modified: 2013-03-29, 05:40 by artrafael.)

Not flak, just a difference of opinion. The problem is that people will keep asking, "my (insert device name here) has an on-board computer (and maybe even runs a variation of (insert name here) operating system), so why can't I run XBMC on it? Why can't you guys make a version for (insert device name here) since it would make a killer app for it and (insert device name here) is (going to be) one of the most popular of its kind and you guys will miss out on media center world domination if you ignore it." On the other hand, if you hookup a computing device with supported hardware running standard Android/iOS/Linux/OS X/Windows, then you'll have XBMC running on your TV immediately. No need for lamentations of "will this work?", "why can't I?", "when will you/I?", "why won't you?" because the on-board computer won't run XBMC. So, yes, personally I would still opt for a separate, upgradeable, non-proprietary device to hook up to an AVR or TV.

nitesh · 2013-03-29, 11:30

Agree with above, I'm guessing a huge project like this has limited resources so in my opinion the dev should be concentrated on a few "popular" devices / hardware / OS's instead of trying to get it working on lots of different propriety hardware...

I'm completely get the cable thing, however for me I've only got one cable to the tv, everything goes into my amp first....
What I'd like to see in the future is proper wireless hdmi (high quality, fast and cheap). Allowing you to route a hdmi signal anywhere wireless would make so many things so much easier...

mtjerneld · 2019-12-30, 16:07

(2013-03-29, 02:08)artrafael Wrote: Not flak, just a difference of opinion. The problem is that people will keep asking, "my (insert device name here) has an on-board computer (and maybe even runs a variation of (insert name here) operating system), so why can't I run XBMC on it? Why can't you guys make a version for (insert device name here) since it would make a killer app for it and (insert device name here) is (going to be) one of the most popular of its kind and you guys will miss out on media center world domination if you ignore it." On the other hand, if you hookup a computing device with supported hardware running standard Android/iOS/Linux/OS X/Windows, then you'll have XBMC running on your TV immediately. No need for lamentations of "will this work?", "why can't I?", "when will you/I?", "why won't you?" because the on-board computer won't run XBMC. So, yes, personally I would still opt for a separate, upgradeable, non-proprietary device to hook up to an AVR or TV.

Just wanted to drop in "a few years later" and state that things turned out the way I hoped and wanted. Most TV vendors dropped their proprietary smart TV OS's and Android is mainstream and runs KODI well enough on modern TV sets.

So I guess everyone wins. TVs can run Kodi natively, but there is also fantastic streaming boxes like the Shield Pro if you want to run externally. I actually have both.

Great time to be alive, happy new years!