[Paul608085]

With Kodi v21 Omega still being in Beta currently, I'm not sure if this is the correct place to post this. If not, please advise how to move it to the appropriate section:

My setup consists of a Sat>IP converter feeding TVHeadend that supplies all of the Free-to-Air satellite channels available in the UK from Astra 28E, and a m3u playlist that supplies all of the required IPTV channels. Kodi is installed on a Sony Android TV, two Amazon Firestick 4K Max's and I also have a Google Chromecast 2020 that is my "testing device". TVHeadend and IPTV Simple Client add-ons are installed on all devices.

The Sony TV and both Firesticks still run Kodi v19 because of problems encountered when using v20, (I can't remember exactly what those issues were).

In TVHeadend backend I have allocated all the selected channels to groups/genres that match the same group names I have used in the IPTV playlists. This setup works really well for us: in the Kodi EPG, all similar channels come under one group name. For example, the satellite delivered "EarthX" channel is in the "Documentaries" group, as is IPTV "Pluto TV Documentaries" and both appear neatly under the same "Documentaries" group heading in the EPG.

However, testing with Kodi v21 Omega shows this problem:

Using exactly the same backend sources, set up in the same way on the client, using the previous example, I now have two different genre groups in the EPG - both headed "Documentaries". One has the satellite channels and the other has the IPTV channels. It is the same for "Entertainment" and "Sports" etc.

In Settings > PVR & Live TV > Channels > Group Manager, I have under "Available Groups", "Documentaries   IPTV Simple Client" and also separately "Documentaries   TVHeadend HTSP Client". The same is true for all categories with channels from both sources.

Can anyone advise how to resolve this please? I'd be happy to stay on Kodi v19, but with Omega being released soon, (I'm assuming), I'm concerned about support being dropped completely for my existing setup - so would like to upgrade if this can be resolved. Also, I always remove and install a fresh version of Kodi - I don't install a newer version over an old one.

[konel]

This is a deliberate change in V21, don't know how you'd work around it other than manually editing the groups in PVR settings.

https://github.com/kodi-pvr/pvr.iptvsimple/issues/807

[Paul608085]

@konel
Thanks for the reply.

It is interesting what some people consider to be "progress"! For me, it will turn a nice looking functioning system into a bit of a mess, if I can't find a workaround.

Can you explain what you mean by "manually editing the groups in PVR settings" please? I already have IPTV Merge installed and was looking in to the settings for that, but couldn't find anything that resolved this issue for me.

My playlist has something like 500 channels and a further 130 from satellite, and I have Kodi installed on 4 devices - so hopefully there is a solution that isn't per channel and per device?

[emveepee]

The PR notes for some this is not progress, it is always that way.  You did have a  opportunity to participate when the PR was opened. 

In any case I don't even under why you need IPTV Merge.  I know NextPVR handles SAT>IP, multiple IPTV streams, PlutoTV multiple EPG source etc, and you can group them however you want and I assume TVHeadend does that as well.  To me having the backend handling things is better than having to muck around with each Kodi instance.  It's also less confusing on what can and can't be recorded.

[Paul608085]

@emveepee
Thanks for your reply.

"You did have a  opportunity to participate when the PR was opened."
TBH, I am a user of software - I have don't really know how it works, nor have the inclination to learn it in detail. I don't know what a PR is, and only recently came across GitHub at all. Not everyone who uses Kodi has an interest in its inner workings.

I am aware of NextPVR, however as far as I can tell, there is no package for it that I can install on my Netgear ReadyNAS 214? I have tried a few times to get IPTV streams working in TV Headend, but without success. TVH sees my playlists, but doesn't give usable channels that can be mapped from it.

If you know of a DEB package for NextPVR that will run on my RN214, (ARM processor), then please direct me towards it.

[emveepee]

Resistance to change is common, I haven't liked every change in Kodi over the years and still don't love Estuary,  but you too must feel overall it is progressing.  Really as a users your only chance for input is during the PR and lengthy alpha and beta cycles.

I wasn't suggesting NextPVR but it sounds more like you need a change in TVHeadend then anything else since you are working around it's limitations and losing PVR in the process.  If your real problem is PlutoTV playlist yes they aren't really for public use and they are hard for every program to play except their custom players.

The deb package for NextPVR is described here https://github.com/sub3/NextPVR/wiki/nextpvr-helper (arm32, aarch65 and amd64) but that requires native generic Linux.  There is also a arm32v7 Docker image.  I'd probably wait until for the next version with OpenTV EPG support for non FreeSat FTA channels.

[Paul608085]

@emveepee

"Resistance to change is common": I am not resistant to change by nature - in fact the opposite, provided that I can see benefits. I spent 35 years working as a technician in the broadcast industry and saw so many technical changes that I lost count a long time ago!

"but you too must feel overall it is progressing": not at all. For me Kodi v19, (as currently installed on our 3 regularly used devices), provided me, and more importantly my family with over 600 channels neatly arranged into 19 genre groups. With v21 the same channels are now spread across well over 30 groups, similar channels are now separated and the whole thing looks untidy. I can't see my family using it.

"Really as a users your only chance for input is during the PR": I still don't know what a PR is?

"it sounds more like you need a change in TVHeadend": unfortunately, the version of TVHeadend I have on my Netgear was developed specially for it, and is not being updated.

Ultimately, right at the moment I don't actually have a problem: Kodi v19 is working well with TVHeadend, and everything looks nice and is easy to use.

My concern was what happens once Kodi v21 is released? I assume that updates for v19 add-ons will stop at some point - what happens then? Will v19 stop working?

If v19 does stop working, and Kodi continues to "progress", then I'm going to have to look for an alternative.

***Unfortunately that NextPVR DEB package wouldn't install, and TBH I don't understand what I would need to do to make it work, (but thanks anyway).

[emveepee]

I would expect if a custom TVHeadend is needed then a generic Linux .deb file won't work without host repos supporting it.

The PR was linked in one of the hyperlinks above.  The are submitted when features are submitted for potential inclusion in Kodi.

Since you skipped v20 maybe v19 will be good enough for your family for years.  If you are happy with the limitations of a an unsupported TVHeadend install then hard to fault it or Kodi.  You can still upgrade to v20 and keep groups and 20.3 was new today so you don't have to be obsolete.

[konel]

In "Settings -> PVR & Live TV -> Channels -> Group Manager" you can edit the content of the groups and hide unneeded ones (it's cumbersome but will do the job).

IPTV merge would help for multiple playlists with IPTV simple client but will be of no use for your scenario.

[jeff.smith]

I've been using Kodi for over 16 years and I'm grateful for the great job you have done.

Channel Group Genres may be progress, but as far as I am concerned, I'm using custom groups
in playlist (... group-title="Movies;USA",HBO Comedy ) and now I have to deal with over 40
instead of 12 groups.

Simplicity is one of the essential GUI design principles. Channel Group Genres Splitting
makes group selection very cumbersome, especially if you have If you have a very large number
of channels and are using custom groups.

Hopping for some solution ...

[Paul608085]

It seems that for many Kodi users, this is a positive change. However for others of us, such as @Jeff.smith and I, it is a retrograde step and a problem.

How difficult would it be for Kodi to incorporate a toggle switch in Settings somewhere, to allow selection of either preference.

Since my last post in this thread, 5 months ago, I have had to "upgrade" to Kodi v21, because v19 would not exit and I had other issues with v20 on my Firesticks.

To reduce the number of Genre Groups to a manageable level, I have had to remove the Kodi TVHeadend add-on and access TVH via a separate app - so Kodi has become less useful for me!

Progress?

[ksooo]

Will be fixed in Kodi v22, once https://github.com/xbmc/xbmc/pull/25475 got merged.

[Paul608085]

@ksooo
Thanks for the reply.

That looks promising.

I have seen that currently, development builds of v22 are being uploaded every other day. Any idea how long it might take for this change to be incorporated into those builds? I did read through the page that you linked to, but that wasn't clear to me.

I am aware of the risks/pitfalls of running alpha/beta development software, so would only try it on my test device initially - but some idea of when it might happen would be useful.

Thanks again!

.

[bouilliabai]

A somewhat related, but different problem.

This is happening on 2 different Android boxes, one ARMv7, the other AArch64. With both Kodi 21.0 Omega and a nightly build from July 15. With both pvr.nextpvr-21.1.0 and pvr.iptvsimple-21.8.4.

Since Kodi Nexus, the All Channels group has changed from listing Hidden TV channels (n) and Visible TV channels (n) in the rightmost two columns to Ungrouped channels (n) and Channels in All Channels (n) respectively. These 2 columns for All Channels are still editable by short press selecting a channel to move it from one to the other, however, in other groups defined on the NextPVR server and from playlists referenced by the IPTV Simple Client, selecting a channel by short press has no effect on either list. Furthermore, the Ungrouped channels (n) table is empty for each group, when it previously included all active channels not in that group. Creating a new custom group in the group manager allows active channels to be moved between the ungrouped and grouped columns, however inactive channels are still shown under "Ungrouped", and selecting one of these channels causes it to disappear entirely.

This behavior makes it especially difficult to manage groups within the Kodi PVR & Live TV Group Manager.

[ksooo]

Except the disappearing channels the described behavior is intended.

Members of groups created in the backend are to be managed by the backend. Kodi does and did never support syncing local changes of groups to the backend. Locally created groups are to be managed locally. Simple and straight from my point of view.